Episode 35: Talk at The Riley Foundation


Everyone knows Ba and Josette and their great work Natural Learning Relationships.

This podcast provides perhaps the best insight into the core of NLR. Consciousness must become the way of all relationships with children. Learn how it works and why this must be so.

There is a spiritual essence expressed in through, and as nature, that is in each of us, and expresses itself in the natural development of children.

If we're going to be with children, be with our life essence, be with the unfolding of our humanity, we have to participate in consciousness with children. We have to understand how the natural laws unfold in a consciousness way.

…We can move away from the hurtful conditioning imposed on children.

Josette said:

…in every age of childhood, and every age of development, something different is organizing.

Human development is governed by natural laws. We’re all unfolding in stages. The variable is the environment. What is the child exposed to in the environment? That's where we come in to play, because we are the environment of the children around us. We create it, we organize it, and we organize our time, and our space, and our relationships to them.

Ba said:

The actualization of wholeness—and the actualization of spirit, is lived through us, through the life force, and through consciousness. If we start relating to children in that way, then we have this great opportunity to allow a transformation to emerge and unfold according to natural laws, just like the flowers in your garden...

To learn more start here: https://luvmourconsulting.com/natural-learning-relationships

Episode 34: William Greene

Today's guest, William Greene, is Professor of Education at Southern Oregon University, which has rapidly become a center for the international holistic education conference. I met William eight or nine years ago, and we shared immediately our great love for holistic education. But most importantly, William is at the center for bringing holistic education to a worldwide audience.

In this podcast, I talk to William about how our own process of learning can intersect with an embodied sense of what’s right, true or meaningful, and how this can in turn tie together with a first nation perspective, with a perspective held in common with people in all parts of the world. And we talk about how to keep that alive in ourselves and in our students and what we all learn from each other in an ongoing conversation.

Episode 33: Jeffrey Pflaum


The story of today’s guest, Jeffrey Pflaum, touches me in so many personal ways. First, he spent from 1968 to 2002 in New York City public schools, bringing one of the most innovative self-reflective music and writing programs, primarily concerned with writing, to the widely-diverse students in the public school in which he worked.

Second, he and I share a bit of a similar background in that you'll hear it in our voices and in the joy and excitement that we have when talking with one another. And third, as you'll hear, the man's heart just vibrates with love for life and love for children. I'm so excited today to be interviewing and working and dialoguing with Jeffrey Pflaum.

If you are interested in checking out Jeffrey’s articles/posts on EI, SEL, reading, writing, creativity, poetry, character formation, values clarification, and thinking, the best place to go is:


Episode 32: Mirian Vilela


Mirian Vilela is the Executive Director of the Earth Charter International Center on Education for Sustainable Development at the University for Peace and is the coordinator of the UNESCO Chair on Education for Sustainable Development with the Earth Charter.

Mirian's perspective on what is sustainability and what the Earth Charter really means is transcendent to how people often think about sustainability, her words ring of a profound connectedness of life, self, education, environment, just wholeness.

She has been working in the field of sustainability since 1990, when she worked for the United Nations Conference on Environment and Development (UNCED) in preparation to the 1992 UN Earth Summit. Prior to that she worked for the United Nations Conference on Trade and Development (UNCTAD).

Episode 31: Doug Selwyn


Doug Selwyn’s long career reminds us of other pioneers who have toiled tirelessly to bring Relationship Based Education to the world and have gone largely unnoticed by the wider public. Thus, he, like Nel Noddings, Ron Miller, Lewis, John Creger, and other podcast guests, deserve some sort of lifetime achievement award. All that we can do is give them a platform to bring their wisdom laced messages to all of us.

Doug Selwyn has been an educator for more than thirty years, the first half as a teacher in K–12 in the Seattle Public Schools and the second half in teacher education, first at Antioch University, Seattle and then for ten years as a professor of education at the State University of New York at Plattsburgh until his retirement in 2017. He received his doctorate from Seattle University in 1991 and was named Washington State social studies teacher of the year in 1990–91. He has published several books on education, most recently Following the Threads (Peter Lang, 2009).

He lives in Greenfield, Massachusetts, with his wife, writer Jan Maher.

Episode 30: Kevin Hawkins

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Kevin Hawkins has worked with adolescents and young people in various contexts for over 30 years - as teacher, school head, and social worker in the UK, Africa, and Europe. He is a Senior Trainer for the Mindfulness in Schools Project (UK) and has taught mindfulness to children, teenagers, teachers and parents since 2008. In 2012 he co-founded MindWell, which supports educational communities in developing wellbeing through mindfulness and social-emotional learning (SEL). he is a facilitator for the evidence-based CARE program (Cultivating Awareness and Resilience in Educators). Kevin is a regular speaker, writer and presenter on the topics of mindfulness, wellbeing and social-emotional learning in education. His book on mindfulness in education, Mindful Teacher, Mindful School, Improving Wellbeing in teaching and learning, was published by SAGE/Corwin in July 2017.


Episode 29: Ali Ronder

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Ali is a founding principle in ICARE (International Council for Accrediting Relationship-Based Education). She lives and breathes education and is deeply invested in shaping the future of learning. ICARE’s mission is to catalyze, synergize, and nourish diverse edu-ecosystems to “enlight and ignite” the evolution of education. Co-creating the ICARE holistic accreditation program is a labor of love and an expression of her utmost respect for colleagues who are doing the vital work of relationship-based education in schools and other programs around the world. http://www.enlightignite.com/

Ali’s learning and teaching experiences span the range of conventional and alternative education approaches. As a child, Ali was homeschooled, unschooled, Waldorf schooled, Montessori schooled, and public schooled. She has worked for (and selected for her daughters’ education) parent-run educational cooperatives, Waldorf-oriented and Montessori preschools, Sudbury schools, traditional public schools, and public charter schools.

Ali has been Development Director and Head of School for Sankalpa Academy, founding executive director of Integrity Academy at Casa de Luz, Center for Integral Studies, and executive director of AHB Community School, a creative and collaborative educational alternative that cultivates authentic, balanced critical thinkers who are prepared for a life of learning and community engagement.

Her early teaching experience focused on early childhood at South Austin Children’s Cooperative, Starbright Preschool, and Escuela Montessori de Montopolis. She taught bilingual kindergarten at Maplewood Elementary (an Austin public school) and kindergarten/first grade at Austin Discovery School, a progressive charter elementary school Ali also helped found the Clearview Sudbury School of Austin.

Ali holds an EC-4 teaching certificate from the State of Texas, a B.A. from the University of Texas at Austin in history/applied learning and development, and an M.Ed. from Texas State University in bilingual/bicultural education. She is currently pursuing her Ph.D. in educational administration at Texas State University. Ali has taught ESL in Mexico and Guatemala at Colegio Cuernavaca, Casa Xelaju, Colegio Alonzo Morelio, and La Pedrera. She also has taught yoga to both children and adults.

Ali has distinguished herself as a community leader, serving on the boards of numerous alternative schools and nonprofit groups that support health and social justice. She is a three-time Texas State University appointee to the Clinton Global Initiative University.

Episode 28: Dr. Greg Cahete

Dr. Cajete is a pioneer in indigenous education, and helping bridge the gap from indigenous education to science. He brings a profound holistic understand, and a wealth of experience to bridge these two worlds.

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Currently, he is Director of Native American Studies and an Associate Professor in the Division of Language, Literacy and Socio cultural Studies in the College of Education at the University of New Mexico.

Dr. Cajete also designs culturally-responsive curricula geared to the special needs and learning styles of Native American students. These curricula are based upon Native American understanding of the “nature of nature’ and utilizes this foundation to develop an understanding of the science and artistic thought process as expressed in Indigenous perspectives of the natural world.

Dr. Cajete has authored fivebooks:

  • “Look to the Mountain: An Ecology of Indigenous Education,” (Kivaki Press, 1994)

  • “Ignite the Sparkle: An Indigenous Science Education Curriculum Model”, (Kivaki Press, 1999)

  • “Spirit of the Game: Indigenous Wellsprings (2004)”

  • “A People’s Ecology: Explorations in Sustainable Living”

  • “Native Science: Natural Laws of Interdependence” (Clearlight Publishers, 1999 and 2000)

Episode 27: Teri Sperry

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Teri Sperry grew up in Tennessee and Nebraska in a family of educators. She earned a B.A. in English from the University of Nebraska at Lincoln and an M.A. in Comparative Literature from the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill with the support of a Mellon Fellowship in the Humanities. Soon after graduate school, she moved to Austin, Texas, the vibrant community she has called home ever since.

She spent much of her professional life as a freelance editor, specializing in scholarly books for university presses as well as other educational materials, a profession that allowed her the flexibility to pursue other rewarding roles: urban homesteader, occasional political organizer, school volunteer and PTO officer, and, most importantly, parent. A passionate advocate for education transformation, she became an educational consultant and publisher in 2011, founding Alt Ed Austin to help families learn about the many unconventional schooling options—holistic, progressive, democratic, self-directed, and other child-centered models—in the Austin area. Her goal is always to find the right fit for each kid.

Teri currently spends much of her time observing in schools, researching and writing about education, consulting with parents about schooling options for their children, and collaborating with schools and other educational organizations to support and strengthen the local alt ed community. Most recently, Teri has been delighted to work with her colleagues at Enlight Ignite and partners at Luvmour Consulting to create the International Council for Accrediting Relationship-based Education (ICARE), an accrediting agency that supports schools in strengthening their holistic practices and overall school sustainability while building public trust in relationship-based education.

Episode 26: Mike Seymour

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Mike Seymour, M.S., has been associated with K-12 education since 1990, most recently in his role as President of The Heritage Institute. Mike is also the founder and Director of a non-profit sponsored by The Heritage Institute, Youth for a New World, which engages youth in global issues and local solutions.

Earlier Mike was a consultant and trainer to schools, school districts and Educational Service Districts on such diverse subjects as leadership, visioning and planning and at-risk students. Mike has been board member, Chairman of the Board and volunteer Executive Director of Community for Youth, a highly innovative and successful mentoring program for disadvantaged students in three of Seattle’s most low-performing high schools. Mike authored a text—Educating for Humanity: Rethinking the Purposes of Education--calling on a new vision for education, showing how important the stakes are today for an integral education realizing the interconnectedness of the world. Mike's Awakening Self blog speaks about the important historic shift humanity is going through in our times, and how awakening into a new consciousness is a global phenomenon.

Mike recently published the biography of a courageous Burundian peacemaker, Prosper Ndabishuriye, who helped change the destiny of his nation during the horrific ethnic violence between Hutus and Tutsis in the 1990's. Mike’s recently published book, If You’re Going to Kill them, You Just Kill Us First, tells Prosper’s heroic story and Mike’s role in the peace-making work.

As part of Mike's long-standing support of environmental sustainability, he attended in July 2013 a Climate Leaders training by the Climate Reality Project founded by former Senator and Vice-President Al Gore, and has offered workshops on climate change. Mike is author of the course Climate Change for Teachers & Kids, now taught by Charity Staudenraus, and offers climate change presentations in his home region.

\Mike was also a facilitator and trainer for the Pachamama Alliance’s symposium titled Awakening the Dreamer, Changing the Dream, with a mission to help foster “an environmentally sustainable, socially just and spiritually fulfilling human presence on Earth” as trhe foremost need of our times.

Mike has a special interest in open, democratic forms of education that allow students to engage in real-world issues. Mike has a B.S. in Comparative Literature from Columbia University and an M.S. in Marriage & Family Therapy from Seattle Pacific University.

Episode 25: Richard Lewis

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Richard Lewis founded The Touchstone Center in 1969. He has been the director of the Center since then, initiating and implementing its various programs. He has edited and written a number of books highlighting the poetic and mythic traditions from diverse cultures, among them Miracles: Poems by Children of the English-speaking World; All of You Was Singing: A Retelling of An Aztec Myth, and The Way of Silence: Prose and Poetry of Basho.

His essays on the imaginative and poetic life of childhood have appeared in journals such as Young Children, Elementary English, Childhood Education, Parabola and Orion, and were collected in his book Living By Wonder: The Imaginative Life of Childhood. His recent books include: Sea Tale, illustrated by Gigi Alvaré, Shaking the Grass for Dew: Poems by Richard Lewis; Each Sky Has Its Words, illustrated by Gigi Alvaré; The Bird of Imagining, illustrated by children from New York City public schools; CAVE: An Evocation of the Beginnings of Art, illustrated by Elizabeth Crawford; A Tree Lives, illustrated by Noah Baen – and In the Space of the Sky, illustrated by Debra Frasier. Forthcoming is From the Sleep of Waters, illustrated by Susan Joy Share – and Taking Flight, Standing Still: Teaching Toward Imaginative and Poetic Understanding – a gathering of essays and reflections which have appeared in Encounter, Teaching Artist Journal and Paths of Learning. A complete listing of his books can be found at Books by Richard Lewis (as PDF).

He has given workshops throughout the United States and Canada, and has taught at the New School for Social Research, Fordham University, Bank Street College of Education, Rutgers University, Western Washington University, Queens College and the Lesley College Graduate School.


  • https://www.amazon.com/Richard-Lewis/e/B001HMLO78/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_6?qid=1543095296&sr=8-6

  • http://touchstonecenter.net/

Episode 24: Fleurette Sweeney

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Fleurette’s focus: Education and learning; the effect of social play and movement on learning; the connection between singing and speaking; economy of place as antidote to globalization; inter-cultural relations.

Fleurette started teaching in 1950 and has spent more than 45 years researching the connection between singing and speaking and the effects of social play on the educative process of children. She collaborated with Mary Helen Richards (1967 to 1985) developing Education Through Music and taught ETM at universities and school districts throughout the US, Canada and Japan. Upon retiring (1996) Fleurette began doctoral studies at UBC. She graduated in 2002. Her dissertation From Sound to Symbol: The Whole Song as Curriculum; The Whole Child as Pedagogue; Observation as Methodology is the basis for her continuing work with children of all abilities, families, and teachers. She founded the Living Language Institute Foundation (1987) under the auspices of which Fleurette and colleagues have developed such projects as: the Singing English Pilot Project (2002-04) to address the needs of teachers and children learning in the multi-lingual classrooms of Metro Vancouver; the Co-lingual Pilot Project (2005) an intergenerational, inter-cultural sharing of folk song-games among neighborhood families living in South Vancouver; and the LLIF Early Childhood Education Training Program (2012). She offers directed studies in Sound to Symbol Praxis at SelfDesign Graduate Institute.

Sound to symbol star!

This is the six sided star that is central to Fleurette’s work as mentioned in the podcast.

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Episode 23: Steven Arnold

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Hopefully many of you have listened to the podcast featuring the esteemed holistic Montessori inspired educator Phi Gang for way back in March, 2018. Phil spent many years working in New Zealand. Well, Phil wrote to me the other day with a present. His friend and colleague from New Zealand, Steven Arnold was coming to Portland and did I want to do a podcast with him?

Steven has created the Peace Experiment, one of the most innovative high school opportunities for teen agers in the world. His infectious enthusiasm, his commitment to Montessori ideals without being constrained by formula or history, and his love of adolescents created an atmosphere and delight as talked.

Steven Arnold has received many awards and accolades. You can read all about it his many achievements in the Shownotes on the website www.Remarkable-Educators.com . For now, enjoy and learn from this Remarkable Educator.


Steven is a Montessori trained teacher 0 - 3 (cert); 3 - 6; 6 - 12, 12 - 15, & 15 - 18yr olds (Diplomas); MEd; Dip Tchng (NZ), BA, BSc, PGDipED, LTCL, LSB, ASB, ANZDA (Accred); SCA (Accred).

He is a teacher trainer, principal, teacher, consultant, guest speaker, parent, board and trustee member. With overseas experience in England, Brunei and Australia, he has taught all levels of education from primary to tertiary.

Steven established New Zealand's first Montessori Secondary School in 2002, then principal at Brisbane Montessori School, and has recently been the Senior Lecturer in Montessori Education at AUT University.

Peace Experiment is the only independent Montessori Secondary Education provider in New Zealand.



Episode 22: Marcia Osoke

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Marcia Osoke is a natural teacher in every sense of the word. She is born to teach; she loves nature. Education is critical; and nature is the best teacher. How to combine them? How to successfully actualize her passions? How to gain public support to do so? Rising to the challenge Marcia and her colleagues created the John Muir Outdoor Charter School in Ashland, OR. 

Getting children outside to learn directly through interactions with nature brings forth a strong sense of place and belongingness. But Marcia doesn’t stop there. She knows that connection with nature leads to profound appreciation of interconnectedness of all life and all people. More compassionate approach to conflicts and greater academic achievement have resulted in the Oregon Department of Education designating the school “Outstanding” every year since 2012.


Episode 21: John Creger

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When John Creger met his first class of sophomores at American High School in Fremont CA, he had an intuition to give these sophomores what his own high school education had failed to give him: a sense of who he was. That first year  John introduced an experiment he calls the Personal Creed Project. For nearly three decades students have described their experience with the Creed Project and John’s course in thought-provoking terms

John’s classroom research has centered on explaining the widespread, continuing enthusiasm for the project from high school and college classrooms across the country. What he has learned has altered his fundamental understanding of the nature of learning. John has come to regard self-knowledge as the missing region of curriculum—and the missing ingredient we all need if we are to engage more deeply in learning.

John has made over 60 presentations at professional gatherings around the country. In 2015, he launched Thriving at the Core Presentations to share his deepened literacy approach with colleagues in their own districts. In his trainings, colleagues have their own encounter with the Personal Creed Project and learn to redesign and teach their own courses to weave students’ self-discovery alongside their academic learning. In recognition of the Personal Creed Project, the National Council of Teachers of English presented John the James Moffett Memorial Award for Teacher Research.

John’s articles have appeared in California English (2002), Urantia Fellowship Herald (2012), NCTE’s Journal of the Assembly for Expanded Perspectives on Learning (2015) and The Center for Partnership Studies Newsletter(August 2018). His first book is The Personal Creed Project and a New Vision of Learning (Heinemann 2004).


John lives with his wife of 30 years in Berkeley CA. Beyond the classroom and his presentations, he enjoys traveling with his wife and two daughters. He composes on the guitar, performs with his jazz trio, and reads and writes about life and learning. He has no immediate plans to retire and leave his sophomores behind.

Episode 20: Ba Luvmour


I, your host Ba Luvmour, am the speaker on the podcast.

With my passion increasing as I engage the 7th decade of my life I am ever more convinced of the critical importance of Holistic Education. And I am convinced of the greatness of the holistic developmental understanding that Josette and I pioneered, articulated, and put into practice more than 30 years ago.

Also, I want you to know more about me, the host of the podcast. I come with a rich history of experience and expertise. Connection with my background will make each podcast more meaningful. I am not an interviewer asking questions as much as I am a colleague engaging in considered dialogue.

We, the team at Meetings with Remarkable Educators, see the need to make some formatting changes. In this podcast I specify the changes and the reasons for them.


As an educator, public speaker, author, seminar leader, and consultant Ba has worked in just about every phase of life with children and families. He enjoys training educators (including administrators) and teaching as faculty in graduate school.

Ba has been a non-profit executive since the beginning of his career and co-founded three schools and a holistic learning center for families and children. He is currently podcast host in the popular series, Meetings with Remarkable Educators.

The foundation for all his work in is an abiding inquiry into the nature of consciousness. This has led him to engage science from physics to brain research, philosophy, meditation practice, and all branches of psychology, education, anthropology, and all contiguous subjects. Ba has authored five eBooks and six print books.


  • https://luvmourconsulting.com/natural-learning-relationships/

  • https://www.amazon.com/Ba-Luvmour/e/B001K8E2E6/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_2?qid=1503934244&sr=8-2

  • https://selfdesigninstitute.org/ba-luvmour/

Click here for a transcript of the podcast

Episode 19: Renee Owen and West Willmore

Renee Owen


Renee Owen’s life mission is to bring wellbeing and harmony into education. This is her twelfth year as executive director at Rainbow Community School, a holistic private school in Asheville, NC, that spans preschool through eighth grade. She is also a founder of Rainbow Institute, an adult learning arm of Rainbow Community School, which hosts the More Than Mindfulness Conference each October. Renee Owen is a doctoral candidate at Columbia University Teachers College in an Adult Learning and Leadership program based on transformative learning. Her forthcoming dissertation is about the experience of K12 teachers who imbed spiritual development within their teaching practices.

West Wilmore

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West has served many roles at Rainbow over the years. From lead teacher of second and third and multiage classrooms, to the professional development coordinator and mentor teacher and now as Rainbow Community School’s curriculum coordinator and development director and Rainbow Institute’s Director of Operations. As a lifelong learner, these varied opportunities have yielded much personal and professional growth, increased enthusiasm and connection to Rainbow’s unique model and philosophy as well as continual interest and motivation to support Rainbow’s growth.

West also brings with her a decade of teaching natural sciences and environmental education to children of all ages. West first became interested in teaching while working with children in environmental education centers and camps. Her own love of the natural world and her joy in sharing this world with children inspired her to pursue a teaching career that used “nature’s theater” as a primary learning environment. Much of West’s own education took place in nature’s classroom where she studied the unique ecosystems of the Appalachian region and the southeastern Barrier Islands, the western United States, and New Zealand.

West’s educational philosophy is anchored in place based and experiential learning. She works to nurture a love of learning by fostering in students deep connections to themselves, their community, and the natural world around them. She strongly believes that direct, authentic and meaningful experience is the primary stepping stone to understanding.

West holds a Bachelors Degree in Natural Resources and Environmental Studies from the University of the South, a Graduate Certificate in Environmental Education from the Teton Science Schools, a Master’s of Education from Montana State University, a school administration license from Appalachian State University, and a graduate certificate in non-profit management from Duke University. She also won WNC’s Best of the Best Teacher – 2nd place in 2012 and 1st place in 2013!

West is also an avid rock climber and travels nationally and internationally with her dog, Willow to climb. West is also a competitive bodybuilder and loves to trail run, cycle, paddle board and backpack.


  • http://rainbowcommunityschool.org/more-than-mindfulness-conference/
  • http://rainbowcommunityschool.org/heart-of-the-matter/
  • http://rainbowcommunityschool.org/news/rainbow-institute-blog/

Episode 18: Pete Young


It is a goal of this podcast to extend understanding of Holistic Education beyond schools—holistic, alternative, homeschooling, or others. To that end our podcast today centers on a remarkable organization dedicated to Rites of Passage, a great and mostly ignored holistic learning opportunity. Pete Young is the designer of the Raven weekend, a Rite of Passage for children between 9 and 12. In existence for 10 years, Pete has recently pioneered a coed Rite of Passage using the Raven format. It is, to our knowledge, the first intensive coed Rite of Passage.

Pete has travelled an unusual path to becoming one of the most creative leaders in the field. Of course it starts and is continually nourished by Pete’s intense desire for self-knowledge and the awakening of consciousness. The led to two critical engagements—the Mankind project and Natural Learning Relationships. Mankind put Pete in touch with coming-of-age Rites of Passage for young men as well as a community dedicated to self-growth. Natural Learning Relationships gave Pete the understanding of how children organize their world and the structure and dynamics of Rites of Passage.

There are those people who engage Natural Learning Relationships and just get it. The appreciation of a child’s consciousness—of how they see and organize their world—clicks with their intuitive and experiential knowledge of themselves and the children in their lives. Often they become Natural Learning Relationships enthusiasts and apply it in their homes, life and schools. Pete became a Natural Learning Relationships enthusiast.

He applied it to his family and saw excellent results. He facillitated Rites of Passage for male teens with the Mankind project and saw the many ways Natural Learning Relationships accurately described how teens organize their world. And then he created the Raven Training, a Rite of Passage for males, at first, and then for males and females together under the umbrella organization Alliance of Generations. Pete added follow up meetings so that the learning of the Raven weekend could grow in all participants.

If that was all Pete did he should be celebrated near and far. But Pete became a leader in Restorative Justice in his home county and regularly works with adjudicated youth in the Oregon penal system.

Pete Young lives holistic insight and practice. That he brings to diverse venues is simply an extension of his life and practice.


Episode 17: Peter Berg

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The author of The Tao of Teenagers : A Guide to Teen Health, Happiness & Empowerment and the founder of YouthTransformations.com and Education Transformation, is a board certified holistic health and mental health coach, a teacher, educational administrator, community organizer, educational consultant, school developer, national trainer and an expert in and an advocate for alternative and integrated education. He has written extensively on alternative, holistic, integrated educational theory and techniques and has founded and co-founded non-profit community and environmental-based organizations.

Peter received his Master’s Degree in Environmental Studies and Education from Antioch University and his Doctorate in Education at Walden University, exploring the ties between school leadership and progressive and holistic education.

Peter maintains partnerships and affiliations with organizations who promote sustainability, social and environmental justice, human rights and holistic health. Often this work entails bringing these organizations together to form partnerships and exchange ideas. Peter has consulted on various start-up schools throughout the country and continues to offer consultations to national and international organizations, schools and individuals.


Episode 16: Debbie Millon

Debbie is head of Wingra School, whose mission is educating the whole child since 1972. Before joining Wingra in 2016, Debbie was the Head of School for 9 years at the Bellwether School, a holistic elementary school in Vermont.

In the late 1990s, she served as the director of the PlayCare Center, a play-based preschool that celebrated children’s sense of wonder and curiosity. While working at the Mathematical Association of America in Washington, DC, Debbie collaborated with university professors to define novel teaching methods to strengthen mathematics achievement in minority high school students.  She also worked in the field of biomechanics, designing prosthetics for children and studying Tai Chi gait in young and elderly adults.

Debbie is committed to using very simple human “technologies”—like listening, speaking from the heart, slowing down, breathing, and connecting to nature—in order to support authentic relationships, a deeper sense of self, an essential shift in consciousness, and aligned living practices. She enjoys exploring new ways to empower and inspire students and adults to gain awareness of themselves, others, and the world around them. Her guiding question: How do we create the conditions for everyone in our community to know that they belong, they matter, they are seen, and their perspectives and gifts are valued?

In this Podcast:

  • The opportunities and challenges as Head of a successful holistic school
  • Developing and sustaining an emergent, whole child curriculum
  • Staff relationships in holistic school
  • Parent relationships in a holistic school

Debbie's profile at Wingra School